One of the issues with following a crime rate is that it perpetuates discrimination.
Even if two groups have the exact same probability of, for example, carrying illegal substances, racist targeting will mean your crime rate will continue to reflect that one group “seems worse”.
You don’t spot crime where you dont look for it.
That’s why it’s important to tackle these issues and make sure there is no racial targeting.
According to the NYPD a suspect is white 16% of the time. Of that number they only get a certain amount of each race as arrestees while the rest walk free. From my quick math it seems to be about right proportionally but on the lower end, more like a “NYPD catches only ~30% of all criminals actively commiting a crime.” All of these numbers were for misdemeanors only, and change greatly with the inclusion of felonies which I can calculate later if you want.
We’re not talking about arrests we’re talking about stops of pedestrians, so none of what you said after the first sentence is relevant.
The NYPD has stopped tens of thousands of pedestrians since Mayor Eric Adams took office – claiming someone “fit a relevant description” or citing a vague reason like “other.” Just 5% of them were white, revealing racial disparities even starker than at the height of former Mayor Michael Bloomberg’s “stop and frisk” era.
Yes. Most studies show blacks commit a majority of the crimes but not 95%
That logic only works under the assumption everyone that commits a crime is caught…
Which is incredibly naive.
You should use “convicted of crimes” not “committed crimes”. And even then, that’s ignoring how our justice system uses insane prison sentences to make people take plea deals. So innocent people are coerced into pleasing guilty to avoid jail.
There are literally no valid, trustworthy crime statistics in the US. Police only stop people they want to stop, they more often than not lie in court to secure convictions, public defenders have obscene caseloads that leave them entirely unable to provide a competent, effective defense, and, as you said, defendants are all but forced into shit plea deals for crimes they usually either didn’t commit or shouldn’t be imprisoned for.
The US justice system isn’t just broken, it’s nearly nonexistent and should be treated as entirely illegitimate.
Actually commit, or arrested for, or convicted for? I’m on mobile and can’t dive the PDF, but “commit” sounds like it’s a denominator, not a numerator.
I’m not sure that attacking the idea of the plea itself is right. Plea deals are useful in a well-run juridical model.
Instead, prosecutors should be barred from overcharging as a form of coercion, which is plainly what they often do today. Some combo of state legislators, the state supreme courts, and the ABA should create guardrails for charging decisions.
Finally, as I understand its history, the broad use of overcharging is a fairly recent development that arose because other parts of our system broke down or were overwhelmed, often because of underfunding and/or political expedience.
Is that disproportionate to the crime rate? If not, then I’m not sure how this is Mayor Adams’ fault.
One of the issues with following a crime rate is that it perpetuates discrimination.
Even if two groups have the exact same probability of, for example, carrying illegal substances, racist targeting will mean your crime rate will continue to reflect that one group “seems worse”.
You don’t spot crime where you dont look for it.
That’s why it’s important to tackle these issues and make sure there is no racial targeting.
Yep.
If you’re only stopping people in cargo shorts to search them for drugs, you’re only going to find drugs on people wearing cargo shorts.
Doesn’t mean they’re the only ones carrying drugs around. They’re just waaaaay more likely to get caught because they’re the ones getting searched
That makes sense. Do you think that there’s a large amount of drug crime among white folks that is presently being ignored?
No cop ever searched me for drugs, even when I obviously smelled like weed. Total white privilege.
I was coming here to post that certain people will use this statistic to claim 95% of crime is committed by non-whites.
But I think you just saved me the trouble by demonstrating my point
Derailing answer for a good faith inquiry.
According to the NYPD a suspect is white 16% of the time. Of that number they only get a certain amount of each race as arrestees while the rest walk free. From my quick math it seems to be about right proportionally but on the lower end, more like a “NYPD catches only ~30% of all criminals actively commiting a crime.” All of these numbers were for misdemeanors only, and change greatly with the inclusion of felonies which I can calculate later if you want.
We’re not talking about arrests we’re talking about stops of pedestrians, so none of what you said after the first sentence is relevant.
Yes. Most studies show blacks commit a majority of the crimes but not 95% https://www.nyc.gov/assets/nypd/downloads/pdf/analysis_and_planning/year-end-2022-enforcement-report.pdf
The arrest rate is around 43% for black people. White is about 17%.
The issue, though, is this is stop and frisk. It is just an excuse to stop people. It isn’t effective law enforcement.
That logic only works under the assumption everyone that commits a crime is caught…
Which is incredibly naive.
You should use “convicted of crimes” not “committed crimes”. And even then, that’s ignoring how our justice system uses insane prison sentences to make people take plea deals. So innocent people are coerced into pleasing guilty to avoid jail.
There are literally no valid, trustworthy crime statistics in the US. Police only stop people they want to stop, they more often than not lie in court to secure convictions, public defenders have obscene caseloads that leave them entirely unable to provide a competent, effective defense, and, as you said, defendants are all but forced into shit plea deals for crimes they usually either didn’t commit or shouldn’t be imprisoned for.
The US justice system isn’t just broken, it’s nearly nonexistent and should be treated as entirely illegitimate.
Actually commit, or arrested for, or convicted for? I’m on mobile and can’t dive the PDF, but “commit” sounds like it’s a denominator, not a numerator.
It breaks down to suspect and arrested.
Don’t delve into conviction rates. You’ll discover quickly how screwed up our system is. It’s still better than anyone else but it’s bad.
You’ll see why plea deals should be banned. They abuse the poor since they can’t afford a competent lawyers.
I personally think plea deals should be banned for that reason. They just allow weak cases to be convicted.
I’m not sure that attacking the idea of the plea itself is right. Plea deals are useful in a well-run juridical model.
Instead, prosecutors should be barred from overcharging as a form of coercion, which is plainly what they often do today. Some combo of state legislators, the state supreme courts, and the ABA should create guardrails for charging decisions.
Finally, as I understand its history, the broad use of overcharging is a fairly recent development that arose because other parts of our system broke down or were overwhelmed, often because of underfunding and/or political expedience.
Removed by mod
Not even close. The vast majority of wealthy nations have far better justice systems than the US.
Better than anyone else?