• pingveno@lemmy.mlOP
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    3 years ago

    Of note, this line:

    Putin used his speech not only to announce recognition of the separatist republics but to make a broader argument that Ukraine is not truly a separate country from Russia, that the West is responsible for this standoff, and that Ukraine will bear responsibility for any “future bloodletting.”

    For people who have dismissed accusations that Russia building an excuse for war, is this not at least ominous? This is the final sentence from the Kremlin’s transcript:

    That raises another question: why was it necessary to make such generous gifts, beyond the wildest dreams of the most zealous nationalists and, on top of all that, give the republics the right to secede from the unified state without any conditions?

    Reading over his speech, it’s hard to see him as viewing Ukraine with its own will. Instead, it is merely a breakaway nation that should be subject to Russia’s will.

    • Olive@lemmy.ml
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      3 years ago

      For people who have dismissed accusations that Russia building an excuse for war

      I’m pretty convinced at this point that a good amount of people on this site that are either Russian/Chinese propagandists, are apologists, or are just in complete denial. Every post about this has someone calling out Western media as fake news, etc, but here you go. Here is the proof. They all look like idiots with their foot in their mouths now.

      • gun@lemmy.ml
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        3 years ago

        Ah yes. The brilliant Russo-Chinese geopolitical strategy. Fund propagandists to spread their agenda on Lemmy of all fucking places.
        When they can’t prove you wrong on an issue, or even imagine how anyone could disagree with them, they resort to calling you a Russian bot, just like the Democrats do to everyone who disagrees with them. Apparently most of the world is Russian bots 😂
        You should be careful throwing around the word “idiot” with that line of argument 😉

        • ArchimedesTesseract@lemmy.ml
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          3 years ago

          It’s not a joint strategy, necessarily. Chinese, I suspect, are simply paid in social credits for displays of fervent nationalism. But it’s certainly cheap enough to pay a room of shills to repeat your talking points of the day. Even on remote outposts like lemmy. For a country with a weak economy and military like Russia, information war is the best bang for the buck.

          • morrowind@lemmy.ml
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            3 years ago

            It’s simpler than that. They’re paid nothing. It’s of their own accord. It’s kind of sad.

          • m532@lemmy.ml
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            3 years ago

            “social credits” Racist dehumanizing USA propaganda.

                • ArchimedesTesseract@lemmy.ml
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                  3 years ago

                  I think you’re just too dim to understand. You brought race randomly into this. Now you cast NATO as some power to be feared. It’s a defensive pack. Russia casts it as a boogeyman to justify invading it’s neighbors. That would make you a Russian bootlicker.

                  • m532@lemmy.ml
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                    3 years ago

                    No, you do not need to fear NATO. Just look away from all the people they killed in Yugoslavia, Libya, Afghanistan… Nothing to see if you just stick your head in the sand.

        • Olive@lemmy.ml
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          3 years ago

          The thing is, your argument is just as thin. There is no point in arguing with a stupid person, because they will just bring you down to their level and win. Which is why you’re not worth it. If you really believe the BS russian propaganda, you’re so far gone it’s not worth it. Russia could nuke Kiev and you would try justify it or call it fake news or something. Take vladdy p’s cock out your mouth.

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
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      3 years ago

      So, according to you, people of Donetsk and Luhansk don’t have the right to self determination. Interesting position to take given that this is precisely what Minsk protocol states, which Ukraine is a signatory to.