I have a question about this, if anybody can help me out. Are Deaf and Hard of Hearing people generally fluent in English (at a similar rate to the general population)? I’ve heard anecdotes about Deaf people who only know ASL, little to no English, but I don’t know how common that actually is. Mainly curious about the US.
I know ofc it’s more complicated than that (ASL isn’t the only sign language used here, and English isn’t the only spoken language, not all Deaf/HH people use sign language, etc.), but I’m just trying to get an idea of the big picture. Like when it comes to TV, are closed captions generally considered ‘accessible’ by the Deaf community?
Apologies if that didn’t make much sense, I had trouble wording it.
So it depends a lot on age, location, and severity of hearing loss. First Deaf and deaf aren’t the same thing. Capital D Deaf means culturally Deaf regardless of severity of hearing loss. Someone can be hard of hearing and Deaf and someone who hears worse may not be. Hoh and deaf people who aren’t Deaf usually are either late deafened or were mainstreamed (basically given hearing aids and usually not taught sign). Little d deaf implies hearing loss severe enough that it would require yelling to have an unaided verbal conversation (not precise but it’s generally accurate).
So for starters, if you grew up with the internet you’re probably fluent in written language, probably English. Unless you’re from a time and place where hearing people weren’t literate you’re probably literate as a deaf person. And to my knowledge there are no widely adopted sign language written forms beyond all caps words in language common to area with sign syntax. That’s why when you see Deaf people struggling with verbal languages it’s usually issues of spelling or syntax not vocabulary. But there’s also fingerspelling. There are a lot more words than signs. Common words quickly get a sign, but shit you don’t have to express face to face often to another Deaf person like professional jargon, you just spell it out.
But think about the 80s-90s in America. People who didn’t learn to read in school were still around. Especially if the system didn’t really care and their parents were illiterate. Even now there are people who can read but not at speaking speed. Captions are fine now, it’s like English to the Dutch. You’ve been using it in entertainment at least partly your whole life. But when it was a language someone half bothered to teach you at ten not so much
Wow, yeah, I hadn’t even considered what difference the internet would have made. Way too often I forget to think about history in its greater context.
And to my knowledge there are no widely adopted sign language written forms beyond all caps words in language common to area with sign syntax.
Not as far as I know, either. About a year ago I learned about a ministry group that translated the entire Christian bible into ASL and made an app where you could watch the videos. I don’t remember the name, but it was cool to learn about. (IIRC, that project was what got me caught up on this question in the first place, lol.)
When you say ‘sign syntax,’ does that mean the same thing as gloss? For example:
YESTERDAY, HOME IX-me STAY
I see it used all the time as a tool for English -> ASL students (of which I am one, lol), but it’s never crossed my mind to wonder what ways it is (and what ways it isn’t) used by the Deaf.
If you don’t mind me asking, are you or someone in your life Deaf? Just curious, since it sounds like you’re more informed than the Average Joe. :)
Yeah there’s a thing where Christians like for their texts to be in every language. It’s probably a lot more of that than anything. ASL was developed by nuns IIRC. It’s definitely not like Plains Sign Language which began as a trade language and eventually developed for the deaf. For as long as modern people of European descent have had sign language we’ve had access to Jesus in it.
I’d give more context but my asl is shit. I don’t really sign beyond insulting the hearing. I’m third generation mainstreamed. (Yeah my great grandparents, grandparents, and parents were all convinced not to teach their children sign language by the experts of the time). And yeah that more or less answers two paragraphs. I’ve been wearing hearing aids since childhood and my mom, grandma, and sister all also have my degenerative hearing loss.
Yeah there’s a thing where Christians like for their texts to be in every language. It’s probably a lot more of that than anything. ASL was developed by nuns IIRC. It’s definitely not like Plains Sign Language which began as a trade language and eventually developed for the deaf. For as long as modern people of European descent have had sign language we’ve had access to Jesus in it.
I’d give more context but my asl is shit. I don’t really sign beyond insulting the hearing. I’m third generation mainstreamed. (Yeah my great grandparents, grandparents, and parents were all convinced not to teach their children sign language by the experts of the time). And yeah that more or less answers two paragraphs. I’ve been wearing hearing aids since childhood and my mom, grandma, and sister all also have my degenerative hearing loss.
I grew up with captions on the tv in the 90s except when my father was watching with us (he hates captions, and I’ll acknowledge they did suck 25 years ago, just less than not hearing sucked). And in early adulthood I went on a journey of self discovery and community discovery of embracing my deafness but I still need to find the time and energy to commit to asl learning
I have a question about this, if anybody can help me out. Are Deaf and Hard of Hearing people generally fluent in English (at a similar rate to the general population)? I’ve heard anecdotes about Deaf people who only know ASL, little to no English, but I don’t know how common that actually is. Mainly curious about the US.
I know ofc it’s more complicated than that (ASL isn’t the only sign language used here, and English isn’t the only spoken language, not all Deaf/HH people use sign language, etc.), but I’m just trying to get an idea of the big picture. Like when it comes to TV, are closed captions generally considered ‘accessible’ by the Deaf community?
Apologies if that didn’t make much sense, I had trouble wording it.
So it depends a lot on age, location, and severity of hearing loss. First Deaf and deaf aren’t the same thing. Capital D Deaf means culturally Deaf regardless of severity of hearing loss. Someone can be hard of hearing and Deaf and someone who hears worse may not be. Hoh and deaf people who aren’t Deaf usually are either late deafened or were mainstreamed (basically given hearing aids and usually not taught sign). Little d deaf implies hearing loss severe enough that it would require yelling to have an unaided verbal conversation (not precise but it’s generally accurate).
So for starters, if you grew up with the internet you’re probably fluent in written language, probably English. Unless you’re from a time and place where hearing people weren’t literate you’re probably literate as a deaf person. And to my knowledge there are no widely adopted sign language written forms beyond all caps words in language common to area with sign syntax. That’s why when you see Deaf people struggling with verbal languages it’s usually issues of spelling or syntax not vocabulary. But there’s also fingerspelling. There are a lot more words than signs. Common words quickly get a sign, but shit you don’t have to express face to face often to another Deaf person like professional jargon, you just spell it out.
But think about the 80s-90s in America. People who didn’t learn to read in school were still around. Especially if the system didn’t really care and their parents were illiterate. Even now there are people who can read but not at speaking speed. Captions are fine now, it’s like English to the Dutch. You’ve been using it in entertainment at least partly your whole life. But when it was a language someone half bothered to teach you at ten not so much
Thank you for your response!
Wow, yeah, I hadn’t even considered what difference the internet would have made. Way too often I forget to think about history in its greater context.
Not as far as I know, either. About a year ago I learned about a ministry group that translated the entire Christian bible into ASL and made an app where you could watch the videos. I don’t remember the name, but it was cool to learn about. (IIRC, that project was what got me caught up on this question in the first place, lol.)
When you say ‘sign syntax,’ does that mean the same thing as gloss? For example:
YESTERDAY, HOME IX-me STAY
I see it used all the time as a tool for English -> ASL students (of which I am one, lol), but it’s never crossed my mind to wonder what ways it is (and what ways it isn’t) used by the Deaf.
If you don’t mind me asking, are you or someone in your life Deaf? Just curious, since it sounds like you’re more informed than the Average Joe. :)
Yeah there’s a thing where Christians like for their texts to be in every language. It’s probably a lot more of that than anything. ASL was developed by nuns IIRC. It’s definitely not like Plains Sign Language which began as a trade language and eventually developed for the deaf. For as long as modern people of European descent have had sign language we’ve had access to Jesus in it.
I’d give more context but my asl is shit. I don’t really sign beyond insulting the hearing. I’m third generation mainstreamed. (Yeah my great grandparents, grandparents, and parents were all convinced not to teach their children sign language by the experts of the time). And yeah that more or less answers two paragraphs. I’ve been wearing hearing aids since childhood and my mom, grandma, and sister all also have my degenerative hearing loss.
Yeah there’s a thing where Christians like for their texts to be in every language. It’s probably a lot more of that than anything. ASL was developed by nuns IIRC. It’s definitely not like Plains Sign Language which began as a trade language and eventually developed for the deaf. For as long as modern people of European descent have had sign language we’ve had access to Jesus in it.
I’d give more context but my asl is shit. I don’t really sign beyond insulting the hearing. I’m third generation mainstreamed. (Yeah my great grandparents, grandparents, and parents were all convinced not to teach their children sign language by the experts of the time). And yeah that more or less answers two paragraphs. I’ve been wearing hearing aids since childhood and my mom, grandma, and sister all also have my degenerative hearing loss.
I grew up with captions on the tv in the 90s except when my father was watching with us (he hates captions, and I’ll acknowledge they did suck 25 years ago, just less than not hearing sucked). And in early adulthood I went on a journey of self discovery and community discovery of embracing my deafness but I still need to find the time and energy to commit to asl learning