• BitsOfBeard@programming.dev
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      1 year ago

      I love Firefox, but we need more variety in browsers and Chromium is just making it worse! There has to be a way to make building browsers simpler without everyone ending up relying on the product that was designed to ruin the free internet.

      • namingthingsiseasy@programming.dev
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        1 year ago

        Yeah, the biggest problem with Firefox is that its engine is so hard to embed. Chrome has endless clones because it’s just so damn easy to embed. And Firefox just has some weak forks like Librewolf.

        I’d really rather see Mozilla focus on this rather than all their other stupid endeavors…

        • Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi
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          1 year ago

          Wish this got upvoted more tbh. The devs of Pulse Browser are trying to make an environment where making a Firefox fork would be easier, but it’s not like Chromium where the engine could be easily embedded. I’ve also heard Second Life had to move to Chromium for their embedded browser after using Gecko and having problems with it.

      • nyan@lemmy.cafe
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        1 year ago

        What we actually need is more variety in rendering engines. There were never that many, and two or three (Presto, Trident, and Spartan if you count it) have been killed off within the past ten years. All that’s left are two lineages: Google’s Blink and its barely-threre parent WebKit (in Apple’s Safari), and Mozilla’s Gecko and its barely-there child Goanna (in Pale Moon).

        Unfortunately, the rendering engine is probably the largest single chunk of code in a browser, and writing a new one (or even forking an existing one) is non-trivial.

        • Bitrot@lemmy.sdf.org
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          1 year ago

          Servo still exists, it is under the Linux Foundation umbrella now after Mozilla abandoned it. Just got some funding in January.

    • Rocha@lm.put.tf
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      1 year ago

      Sure, they just need to fix their annoying bugs on Android.

      Everytime I leave a tab open and switch to another app, it’s a 50/50 whether I return to a black screen and am forced to restart it or it just works fine.

      • marx2k@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Yup that’s been a long running issue with Firefox on android. Thought it was just me at first then saw forums where tons of people have the issue and the only suggestion is to reinstall it

      • dtc
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        1 year ago

        I thought it was a problem with my phone since I’m using a custom ROM and it did not happen before. When I open Firefox and it has been in the background for a while, it shows a black screen where the web content should be and often crashes if you try to open another tab or do something else. Also happens if I open a link from another app. The only solution is to close Firefox and swipe it off the recent apps and reopen it. Is this the same problem you have?

        • Rocha@lm.put.tf
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          1 year ago

          Yep, I have it on my Poco F5 with MIUI and a friend that has a Galaxy S23 with stock OS also has the same issue.

          • swayevenly@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            I never had an issue with Firefox. Sounds like it’s specific to your friend’s settings not model.

            • Rocha@lm.put.tf
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              1 year ago

              A lot of people are saying they suffer the same and me and my friend have completely different devices with different Android flavours.

              It doesn’t seem to be what you are saying.

            • zod000@lemmy.ml
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              1 year ago

              I have never had an issue either. We’re all just tiny anecdotes in a sea of users. I mean, people that don’t have issues won’t generally post about it on forums, so of course people will generally only see others posting about similar issues unless they are some magical unique unicorn.

      • hereticpilgrim@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I had to uninstall since it was draining my battery. On one day it was 40% of my battery usage with just 1 minute on time actually open.

    • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Actually I’m sure most of us are just baffled that people will make extremely shitty choices just because others do

    • Kayn@dormi.zone
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      1 year ago

      Firefox fans spamming F5 for any thread that they can comment “Firefox” on

      Geez you guys can’t take a joke.

        • Nepenthe@kbin.social
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          1 year ago

          The thing is — not trying to sound snarky about this — do you honestly believe there is someone on the fediverse that hasn’t heard of Firefox before.

            • Kayn@dormi.zone
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              1 year ago

              What makes you believe excessive comment spam will make them switch?

              • xkforce@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Probably the same reason you made these comments despite knowing that the odds of you convincing them of your position is indistinguishable from zero.

          • Serinus@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            I believe there are people here who still haven’t switched, and this post about a problem and the obvious solution could convince them.

            Do they already know the argument? Sure. It’s a pretty simple one.

            • Nepenthe@kbin.social
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              1 year ago

              The post can, yeah. The predictability with which all posts or comments containing the word “Google” will have several responses underneath evangelizing Firefox almost certainly will not, after it exceeds a point it very clearly routinely exceeds.

              Not because you guys are wrong, (you’re not), but because you’re annoying, which is almost as bad. There is something in psychology called reactance theory, and it’s the reason why, when you’re just about to do the dishes and then someone else tells you to do them, it’s suddenly the last thing on earth you want to do.

              It is a choice so small it isn’t worth arguing over, but it’s no longer your choice born out of your own free will, and now you feel cheated and resentful and you are not doing it, both out of spite and more truthfully to regain your sense of choice.

              This is the same reason everyone hates vegans so much. They’re not wrong. They’re annoying. Firefox has vegan PR.

              I held off listening to Hamilton for three years for no other reason than nobody else I met would shut the goddamn fuck up about Hamilton. Same with the TV version of Good Omens, whatever stupid cartoon jester thing has been in a third of the memes lately, and a hundred other things.

              I am very likely to switch over to Firefox myself in the ever-nearing future. That ice is breaking. But it will not be because a bunch of strangers whined at me over my own choices for over a decade. It will be because the cons of whatever Google, Windows, etc. have done finally outweigh the pros of not having to exert effort to maintain my experience.

              It bears consideration that in the meantime, Firefox users have a tendency not to even read the several duplicate comments before they start jacking off into them, often in a way that’s loudly judgemental towards their own target audience.

              The resultant spam cements a mental association between Firefox, the brand and the feeling of being annoyed and insulted. Don’t be those vegans. If I had to think, be like the art community treats Adobe. Fuck Adobe, but I’m not just gonna overload someone with aggressive pompousity who’s only using the industry default.

      • Etterra@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I didn’t want you to think I down voted because I disagreed with you. You’re quite right. I down voted you because it was a dumb joke.

      • Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi
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        1 year ago

        I think the main issue is the people here suggesting and evangelising Firefox not really listening to those who aren’t, which frustrates the other person. I think I fell into this with the fediverse, in the early days of Elon fucking up Twitter. There are perfectly valid reasons to not use Firefox right now. Maybe one browser or other works better for them, or has that one killer feature they can’t live without. Firefox has that for some of us, too. Or Firefox has some weird quirk or bug that other browsers don’t.

        I personally use Firefox and Vivaldi. Vivaldi has tab tiling which is great for when I’m in the zone adding music to MusicBrainz or RYM, and it’s not too clunky either. Tile Tabs WE doesn’t cut it for me. For casual browsing, vertical tabs is nice and I use Firefox + Sidebery for that, which is better than Vivaldi’s vertical tab implementation.

        • Kayn@dormi.zone
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          1 year ago

          I think the main issue is the people here suggesting and evangelising Firefox not really listening to those who aren’t

          That’s exactly it. A few months ago I saw a conversation on Lemmy where someone was listing the features they were missing in Firefox, and someone literally replied “There is no way you need any of this shit”.

          • Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi
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            1 year ago

            And even when they say tab hibernation does exist, they’re calling OP a dumbass. If I did that to my friends who want to try Linux, they’d be back on Windows in a heartbeat.

            I’ve also been shouted at here for telling a user asking about Vivaldi that the culture here does not like Chromium-based browsers like it and they likely won’t get their answer here. It’s like they wanted me to shut up and not criticise their behaviour.

  • donut4ever@sh.itjust.works
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    1 year ago

    That, my friends, is why we kept fighting for firefox. It doesn’t matter if you like or dislike Mozilla foundation, they have to exist because of shit like this

    • Zerush@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      Firefox has the same problem with V3, it has nothing to do with the browser, adblocker V2 will stop working, because are the advertising companies wich will use V3 scripts. For Chrome and Chromium the only thing is, that are no more V2 adblocker in the Chrome Store and installed adblock extensions won’t work anymore. after June 24. But don’t panic, the fact that adblocker V2 stops working does not exclude that there will be adblocker V3, the devs of these are not going to rest on their laurels either.

    • ava@feddit.de
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      1 year ago

      yet we already have a working implementation of ublock origin for mv3 by it’s main developer, gorhill

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        1 year ago

        When I read about that like a year ago gorhill had clearly stated that the mv3 version’s efficacy is severely kneecapped and while it works as well as it can it’s extremely bad in comparison to the present version on Firefox and Edge

          • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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            1 year ago

            Edge has been picking and choosing what features to carry over and off the top of my head announced they wouldn’t be merging in the most unpopular MV3 changes

      • chris@l.roofo.cc
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        1 year ago

        More than the company that literally is a for profit that makes a browser that kneecaps adblocking and puts an ad targeting protocol onto the Browser?

        • Bitrot@lemmy.sdf.org
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          1 year ago

          Mozilla Corporation is a for profit company that builds Firefox. The Mozilla Foundation is nonprofit.

          MZLA Technologies, the Thunderbird company, is also for profit which is why donations to them are not tax deductible.

      • Flaky@iusearchlinux.fyi
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        1 year ago

        Those two aren’t bad, IMO. It lines up with what people think their principles should be.

        You want something to make you worry? They’re integrating Fakespot, an AI-based review scanner that Mozilla acquired a while back, into Firefox. Never mind that industries are having problems auto-scanning content for AI generated prose…

  • MonkderZweite@feddit.ch
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    1 year ago

    Google justified this change by highlighting how extensions using the Web Request API could access and modify all the data in a network request, essentially being able to change everything that a user could do on the web (which is pretty scary and problematic when you think about it which is a perfectly valid usecase of a user-installed extension).

    • whoareu@lemmy.ca
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      1 year ago

      People don’t even know about manifest v3 let alone switching to Firefox. They will just use whatever google throws at them.

  • YⓄ乙 @aussie.zone
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    1 year ago

    Goddamnit I missed out again, faaaackkk! Why do i keep using Firefox ? Why?

    • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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      Because you don’t randomly insist that your tab UI is some extremely fucking specific way that is somehow required to use the Internet! The nerve!

  • Z3k3@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    I could have sworn I saw something saying Google caved on this due to pressure.

      • SokathHisEyesOpen@lemmy.ml
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        That’s an important distinction. Whenever trillion dollar tech companies say they’re not going to do something hugely unpopular and selfish because of public sentiment, what they really mean is they’re not going to do it right then. Instead they back off, do something like this to get everyone’s attention focused elsewhere, and then they’ll push the original unpopular idea anyways, but quietly.

        • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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          I’ve never really understood the obsession with this. Yes, it’s true, but 1) they’ve never killed anything I actually cared about 2) they can’t support infinite software forever. 3) this discussion has nothing to do with anything here. They aren’t going to “kill” ads, it’s literally the one thing about their company that will never not be the focus.

    • Tibert@jlai.lu
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      1 year ago

      It was something else. Web drm : Web Integrity API.

      Tho I don’t think they canceled the mobile variant of it for apps.

    • SokathHisEyesOpen@lemmy.ml
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      They backed off their web drm, because it was hugely unpopular, but also because they remembered they own chromium and can just disable adblockers directly. They tried to over-engineer something that requires everyone else to adopt a new standard, when all they ever needed to do was use a sledgehammer.

  • corbin@infosec.pub
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    1 year ago

    This article is really wrong, wow. There is already a Manifest V3-compliant version of uBlock Origin, it’s discussed in this thread: https://github.com/uBlockOrigin/uBlock-issues/issues/338

    I don’t know if it’s stated definitively anywhere, but I’m pretty sure the plan is to roll out that different version to Chrome users as an update to the existing extension. It’s going to be slightly worse because MV3 is still missing some API features.

    • katy ✨@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      that version works but it’s always been a lite version compared to the standard ublock origin with far less capabilities and features.

      • corbin@infosec.pub
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        Right, my point was just that the article is wrong/clickbait. The changes won’t “disable uBlock Origin” or “essentially kill off uBlock Origin”.

        • Phrodo_00@lemmy.world
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          The V3 version of ublock should really use a different name to make it clear it doesn’t have the same capabilities as in V2/Firefox. Maybe something like UBlock use-firefox-instead.

    • meteokr@community.adiquaints.moe
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      1 year ago

      Peertube doesn’t give ad revenue sharing, so most content creators can’t afford to make content for a platform with no return. If someone was uploading a video for their friends, or a school project, then sure, open platforms are perfect.

      • anachronist@midwest.social
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        1 year ago

        Vast majority of creators make pennies from youtube ads. They make their money from patreon and sponsorship, neither of which are incompatible with peertube.

        The biggest problem vis-a-vis youtube is that people won’t find you if you are not on it and blessed by the algorithm. Youtube is a monopoly because of metcalfe’s law.

        • meteokr@community.adiquaints.moe
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          1 year ago

          People were uploading, and still are. Uploading a video for my friends, or a school project which needs no return open platforms work perfectly. Irrelevant to my point.

          Companies/Content Creators are on the platform because it pays them. If being on youtube did not pay them, they would go to a platform that did, eg twitch, tiktok.

      • 1984@lemmy.today
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        1 year ago

        They can’t afford? YouTube creators do it for attention and the possibility to become well known, not for the few dollars that YouTube shares with them. And also for the pleasure of helping others.

        Literally any real job pays 100x what YouTube pays, so if money was the objective, these guys would not sit and make YouTube videos.

    • 𝘋𝘪𝘳𝘬@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      Since Chrome does not “disable uBlock Origin” but Google deprecating manifest V2 in favor of manifest V3 it will be done in Chromium because Chromium does the heavy lifting and Chrome is “just a Chromium based browser”.