I’d have agreed with you pre-2025. But I could see it now. The Dems have been letting us down over and over again. We need a party that cuts out billionaire money and promises to enforce the same on all politicians once they take power.
It could still be something like 40% third party 15% democrats and 45% republicans, unless Republicans split as well, a third party can only make the “left” weaker.
We see it in Europe in countries where the left parties refuse to create alliances for ideological reasons.
It’s actually exactly how the Weimar Republic fell giving rise to the Nazis. The right was united enough to form a government after the splintered left and center failed multiple times consecutively.
Either that it would result in the Democratic party collapsing entirely, why would anyone vote for it if there was a better alternative available? You might see the Republicans win an election or two but that happens anyways
The problem is, it is very hard to win elections without money. So a party that cuts out billionaire spending is less likely to win while also splitting the dem vote.
The DNC didn’t have foreign bot farms and billionaires on their side.
I know! Maybe if they abandon everyone that you don’t care about and focus only on the bot farms and billionaires that you do care about, they’ll win!
Democrats can’t keep moving to the right like you want them to. They hit a wall. They peeled off none of the republican votes you envy. But they got to throw people you hate under the bus, so it’s good for you.
They’ve literally won the majority of elections since the 90s by appealing to moderates. They lost in 2024 because Russia had a war at stake and billionaires didn’t want to get taxed. Add in inflation from the pandemic and you have a tough campaign to win.
The argument that democrats can’t win without the left is not based on reality.
Dems tried to appeal to leftist and they screeched “genicide Joe” until Trump won.
Meanwhile republicans won because voters to the right of leftist know the importance of not shitting on the candidate they want to win.
Splitting the dem vote implies that Democrats are entitled to all votes, not Republican. They have never done anything to earn mine. And after lurching far to the right, like they did this last election, I can’t see how anyone thinks that they have earned their vote.
In case you didn’t know leftists are not Democrats, Democrats are closer in policy to Republicans than leftists are Democrats. Your party hosted more cops, zionists, and Republicans onto their convention stage than they did progressives. They cuddled up with right wing war criminals, and tried to out Republican Republicans. Your party did this.
In the US that spectrum doesn’t exist to the left of democrats. It ends at democrats.
Those cops, zionists and republicans are also a part of our democracy and they have a vote. Leftists consistently lose elections for not considering this.
Democrats tried to be less moderate in 2016 and 2024 and lost because of it. Which is expected because leftists can’t win elections.
Republicans didn’t win because the DNC couldn’t attract more voters on the center and right. Republicans didn’t win because more people joined them in 2024, their numbers barely changed at all. Republicans won because leftists stayed home.
Because we refused to empower the DNC. Because the left splintered.
Why are you posting irrelevant bullshit? We’re not talking about running a “third party” candidate. We’re talking about destroying the Democratic party and rebuilding it into something that isn’t traitorous and corrupt.
it’s time for the Democrats to go the way of the Whigs.
This logic of yours? Has it actually resulted in snowing or stopping fascism? Now it hasn’t. Maybe it’s time we try something different than what’s obviously not working
Sounds like you’re trying to dismiss my argument out of hand by associating me with the pro-fascist concern trolls and their useful idiots who did that in this previous election. You can fuck all the way off with that dishonest, ad-hominem bullshit.
There’s a huge fucking difference between abandoning a candidate in the middle of the election with fuck-all for alternatives, and trying to reform or replace the party with literally as much margin as possible before the next election. If now is not the right time to try to get shit done, when is? Tell me that, O Great Arbiter of Political Acceptability!
You need to quit your bullshit, and on top of that you owe me a goddamn apology.
You say splitting is a guaranteed benefit to the GOP, but I’d say that keeping the resistance neutered by being stuck behind “leadership” that’s ineffectual at best, or a traitorous quisling at worst, benefits the GOP even more.
Anyway, I’m not arguing for splitting the opposition. I’m arguing for supplanting it so thoroughly that the old guard (Schumer, Pelosi, et al.) finds it untenable to continue.
If that fails, it fails, and we crawl back and support the Democratic candidate as a last-ditch effort at harm reduction, just like before. But we’ve got to try, because otherwise Schumer is going to “collaborate” us straight into the gas chambers.
The problem with that approach is you do all the work for the GOP propaganda machine every time you argue against a democratic candidate.
So by the time your revolution fails, your campaign gets weaponized by the GOP. Everything negative you had to say about the democrat candidate is now being said by the GOP. And it’s super effective at convincing some democratic voters to stay home because it’s the same talking points used by their own party.
Instead of trying to discourage voters from choosing democrats, leftists should just say why voters should chose the leftist and accept the results when voters choose the moderate option.
That would guarantee more Republican wins
I’d have agreed with you pre-2025. But I could see it now. The Dems have been letting us down over and over again. We need a party that cuts out billionaire money and promises to enforce the same on all politicians once they take power.
It could still be something like 40% third party 15% democrats and 45% republicans, unless Republicans split as well, a third party can only make the “left” weaker.
We see it in Europe in countries where the left parties refuse to create alliances for ideological reasons.
It’s actually exactly how the Weimar Republic fell giving rise to the Nazis. The right was united enough to form a government after the splintered left and center failed multiple times consecutively.
Either that it would result in the Democratic party collapsing entirely, why would anyone vote for it if there was a better alternative available? You might see the Republicans win an election or two but that happens anyways
The problem is, it is very hard to win elections without money. So a party that cuts out billionaire spending is less likely to win while also splitting the dem vote.
The Democrats wanted to tax the rich and they still got way more donations than Trump, but all of that pales in comparison to buying out Twitter.
You don’t have to be poor to see that Republicans are a threat to us all.
Democrats outraised trump and still lost.
You need to not tell your voters to fuck off if you can imagine that.
The DNC didn’t have foreign bot farms and billionaires on their side.
Elon literally bought votes but you don’t count that when you say “outraised Trump”.
I know! Maybe if they abandon everyone that you don’t care about and focus only on the bot farms and billionaires that you do care about, they’ll win!
Democrats can’t keep moving to the right like you want them to. They hit a wall. They peeled off none of the republican votes you envy. But they got to throw people you hate under the bus, so it’s good for you.
They’ve literally won the majority of elections since the 90s by appealing to moderates. They lost in 2024 because Russia had a war at stake and billionaires didn’t want to get taxed. Add in inflation from the pandemic and you have a tough campaign to win.
The argument that democrats can’t win without the left is not based on reality.
Dems tried to appeal to leftist and they screeched “genicide Joe” until Trump won.
Meanwhile republicans won because voters to the right of leftist know the importance of not shitting on the candidate they want to win.
That’s a bit of a fib, isn’t it?
Not even a little
Splitting the dem vote implies that Democrats are entitled to all votes, not Republican. They have never done anything to earn mine. And after lurching far to the right, like they did this last election, I can’t see how anyone thinks that they have earned their vote.
Then you will get more Trump and the GOP and fascism
Doing things your way did just that.
Dems have won the majority of elections since the 90s. Biden/Harris lost because of inflation.
Republicans lost by waaay more in 2020. If they followed your mentality they would’ve lost in 2024. Instead they doubled down and won.
Democrats did what you wanted in 2016 and 2024 and lost. But at least you didn’t have to move to the left.
You prefer trump to moving to the left.
Leftists aren’t winning elections.
Dems tried to cater to leftists in 2016 and 2024 and lost as a result.
The majority of Americans don’t want leftist politicians as we can see with election results.
Leftists are forcing Dems to the right by giving the elections to Trump
The DNC gave us Trump and fascism.
Na. That was fake leftists screeching “genicide Joe” and claiming both sides are the same.
In case you didn’t know leftists are not Democrats, Democrats are closer in policy to Republicans than leftists are Democrats. Your party hosted more cops, zionists, and Republicans onto their convention stage than they did progressives. They cuddled up with right wing war criminals, and tried to out Republican Republicans. Your party did this.
Left and right is a spectrum of ideology.
In the US that spectrum doesn’t exist to the left of democrats. It ends at democrats.
Those cops, zionists and republicans are also a part of our democracy and they have a vote. Leftists consistently lose elections for not considering this.
Democrats tried to be less moderate in 2016 and 2024 and lost because of it. Which is expected because leftists can’t win elections.
Keeping the dnc intact ensures that government is run by Republicans.
Republicans didn’t win because the DNC couldn’t attract more voters on the center and right. Republicans didn’t win because more people joined them in 2024, their numbers barely changed at all. Republicans won because leftists stayed home.
Because we refused to empower the DNC. Because the left splintered.
How so? Republicans lost by a lot more in 2020 than dems lost by in 2024.
The Republicans are literally couping the government as we speak
And splitting into a 3rd party would divide all opposition to republicans during a coup. Sounds like something they want.
Starting a 3rd party has always been a bad faith argument meant to weaken votes against republicans.
No.
It would guarentee more Republican wins
Why are you posting irrelevant bullshit? We’re not talking about running a “third party” candidate. We’re talking about destroying the Democratic party and rebuilding it into something that isn’t traitorous and corrupt.
it’s time for the Democrats to go the way of the Whigs.
Sounds like you’re warming up for the next election when you’ll be trying to convince people not to vote or vote 3rd party.
This logic of yours? Has it actually resulted in snowing or stopping fascism? Now it hasn’t. Maybe it’s time we try something different than what’s obviously not working
How would making it easier for fascism to win, help stop fascism? Your logic doesn’t make any sense.
Sounds like you’re trying to dismiss my argument out of hand by associating me with the pro-fascist concern trolls and their useful idiots who did that in this previous election. You can fuck all the way off with that dishonest, ad-hominem bullshit.
There’s a huge fucking difference between abandoning a candidate in the middle of the election with fuck-all for alternatives, and trying to reform or replace the party with literally as much margin as possible before the next election. If now is not the right time to try to get shit done, when is? Tell me that, O Great Arbiter of Political Acceptability!
You need to quit your bullshit, and on top of that you owe me a goddamn apology.
Splitting the only opposition to the Republican Party during a coup is a guaranteed benefit to the GOP.
That’s what you are arguing for.
You want me to apologize for pointing out the cause and effect of what you’re asking for?
You say splitting is a guaranteed benefit to the GOP, but I’d say that keeping the resistance neutered by being stuck behind “leadership” that’s ineffectual at best, or a traitorous quisling at worst, benefits the GOP even more.
Anyway, I’m not arguing for splitting the opposition. I’m arguing for supplanting it so thoroughly that the old guard (Schumer, Pelosi, et al.) finds it untenable to continue.
If that fails, it fails, and we crawl back and support the Democratic candidate as a last-ditch effort at harm reduction, just like before. But we’ve got to try, because otherwise Schumer is going to “collaborate” us straight into the gas chambers.
The problem with that approach is you do all the work for the GOP propaganda machine every time you argue against a democratic candidate.
So by the time your revolution fails, your campaign gets weaponized by the GOP. Everything negative you had to say about the democrat candidate is now being said by the GOP. And it’s super effective at convincing some democratic voters to stay home because it’s the same talking points used by their own party.
Instead of trying to discourage voters from choosing democrats, leftists should just say why voters should chose the leftist and accept the results when voters choose the moderate option.
More wins than they already won?
Of course