• u_tamtam@programming.devOP
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    1 year ago

    A more accurate title could be “Privacy is Priceless, but Centralization is Expensive”: with the era of cheap money coming to an end, grows a lot of uncertainty regarding the future of some large internet services. Signal is no exception and this emphasises the importance of federated alternatives (XMPP, fediverse, …) for the good health of the future internet.

    • Goronmon@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Decentralization is expensive too judging by some of the sentiment I’ve seen around running Mastodon and Lemmy/Kbin instances.

        • pizzaboi@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          And why wouldn’t they? 90% of the software people use daily is free (as in beer), so of course being told that’s going to change is going to cause upset. It takes a lot for people to want to pay money for something that, to those who don’t value free (as in freedom) software, is no different than the costless alternative.

      • BaroqueInMind@kbin.social
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        1 year ago

        At some point society needs to figure out how we can subsidize the costs of data storage, remote servers, and provision of internet to people for free.

        • JustEnoughDucks@feddit.nl
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          1 year ago

          The only real way to do that is government subsidized servers, but that will fall in the same category as literally every other government service: right wing political entities try to privatize it and make it as shitty and parasitic as possible.

        • pizzaboi@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          You pay for these things with your data. If the government is paying for privacy-respecting storage or safe internet access, then so are you with your taxes. I’d vote for that, but I’d guess the majority of people would not.

        • Venia Silente@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          There’s nothing to figure out, if the question is how “society” does it then the answer is literally taxes.

      • u_tamtam@programming.devOP
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        1 year ago

        Yup, it has a cost, but there’s perhaps a one or two orders of magnitude cost difference between hosting instant messaging + calls with something like XMPP, and hosting mastodon/Lemmy/Kbin (or why I do the former but not the later, and why I’m ok to pay for the service, esp. considering that my instance’s business model isn’t, unlike Reddit, to re-sell influence and data).

      • u_tamtam@programming.devOP
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        1 year ago

        Decentralized messaging is comparatively very cheap (at least in the case of XMPP): it doesn’t require nearly as much storage (and what is stored is short-lived considering it’s end-to-end encrypted) nor bandwidth (messages are mere bytes, A/V calls are peer-to-peer most of the time), so we are far from what it takes to self-host mastodon and lemmy (with the expectation that any post can be accessed at any time, and content never expires).

    • Avid Amoeba@lemmy.ca
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      1 year ago

      Decentralisation would just spread the costs over more individuals. Those individuals would have to collect contributions from their respective communities. The total amount people who would have to chip in to make the system sustainable won’t change dramatically. Decentralisation isn’t some magic wand that makes infrastructure and labor costs disappear into thin air.

      • u_tamtam@programming.devOP
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        1 year ago

        Decentralisation would just spread the costs

        …the costs and the risks: let’s jump forward a few years into financing issues, at what point does Signal become a liability and start operating against their stated mission, if the alternative is that they cannot survive? We are witnessing enough contemporary examples of enshittification to know that it’s a real possibility, and that all centralized providers, but in particular the ones not charging for service, are at risk.

        Some would even argue that this has already started in the case of Signal with their crypto payments and blocking of 3rd party clients which are clearly user-hostile.

        Those individuals would have to collect contributions from their respective communities.

        Perhaps, or perhaps not. Running costs get exponential with scale. You can host 1000 users on a shoebox computer/raspberry pi, but delivering a service for millions requires datacenter-level infrastructure and tons of engineering know-how.
        Most people into self hosting or having a NAS at home can already accommodate their families, friends and more, which means millions of potential users, without the problem of trust from a single organization