- cross-posted to:
- usa@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- usa@lemmy.ml
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Boy do I love living surrounded by these loving christians.
Born too late to explore the earth, borth too early to explore the stars, born just in time to have my rights taken away by belivers in a bronze age supernatural death cult.
Fucking amazing.
I was corrected on this recently. The Hebrew Bible was written by Iron Age folks. As was the Gospels.
FYI
The old testament is just a riff on old Sumarian myths, so… still pretty much bronze age.
Half of Noah’s ark is in Gilgamesh. He meets a man that the gods are punishing for doing the whole Noah thing with immortality after he crosses that underworld ocean with that giant stack of paddle sticks. Flood , dove with olive branch and all. I think he was trying to help his buddy Enkidu if I remember correctly. Poor Enkidu :( he should have stayed a beast and lived his life with the deer.
That’s a very positive outlook that humanity will survive to explore the stars without being killed by religious fascists.
You live in amazing times where we are inventing and learning new shit all the time. If you’re not exploring now when that exploring is relatively very safe, you wouldn’t be the one sailing off to the new world hundreds of years ago. People can be miserable or content in their own time, no matter what that time is.
Didn’t this religious asshole take an oath to uphold the constitution that literally decrees separation of church and state‽ Grounds for a firing.
Religious institutions that use government power in support of themselves and force their views on persons of other faiths, or of no faith, undermine all our civil rights. Moreover, state support of an established religion tends to make the clergy unresponsive to their own people, and leads to corruption within religion itself. Erecting the ‘wall of separation between church and state,’ therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society.
—Thomas Jefferson
When a religion is good, conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obliged to call for help of the civil power, 'tis a sign, apprehend, of its being a bad one.
—Benjamin Franklin
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/thomas-jefferson-religious-institutions/
I agree with your sentiment, but please don’t spread misinformation regardless of intent.
Proper quote:
Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should “make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.
(From your snopes link)
religious whackjobs in the government attempt to rebrand ‘religion’ to ‘faith’ in an attempt to claim all americans should suffer from it.
it will only cause me to hate 2 words instead of the one.
You should already hate faith. Faith is what the religious use to justify doing nothing themselves.
Hell, faith is the reason half of them are sitting around hoping for Armageddon…
Capital-F Faith is directly contrary to science and reason. It’s believing things to be true without question or proof.
You can be spiritual and also be a logical person who listens to reason and science. But when you devote your entire worldview to Faith, then you should absolutely NOT be in a position to make decisions that affect other people’s lives.
Capital-F Faith is directly contrary to science and reason. It’s believing things to be true without question or proof.
It’s worse than that. It’s believing things despite contrary evidence. It’s why you can never win any “debate” with believers. They literally believe that you telling them they’re wrong proves that they are right.
My faith is in the fact that the world is created anew with the appearance of age every Thursday. We don’t notice because we are created with memories of an entire history. But we are fooled, and each week the world gets stranger and stranger.
If I were to govern under this faith, I wouldn’t bother planning anything longer than a week. I’m sure they wouldn’t respect my freedom of religion, then.
Yeah I’m religious (syncretic neopaganism), but seeing as I live in the real fucking world where there’s plenty I don’t know I have to assume that part of what I don’t know is the nature of divinity. And I’m certainly not so damn confident in my religion to force people to it. I’m only that confident in the scientific method as a means of seeking truth.
In evidence we trust.
The Bible itself defines faith as: “Faith is the assured expectation of what is hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities that are not seen.”
And “demonstration” can also be translated as “convincing evidence”.
So faith would be something like having a friend who is a good mechanic that likes helping people, and him telling you that if you ever need help on your car he’s offering to help.
You have faith that he is able to see his offer through and fix your car, even though you’ve never seen him work on any car before.
I think most people today would call that trust, and the word faith has become synonymous with “blind faith”, which is what you described with
It’s believing things to be true without question or proof.
I’m not trying to say you’re wrong or anything, as languages do change over time. But I think it’s fair to recognize those differences in definitions.
faith is what i have in my wifes love for me. i dont want to hate faith, just its abuse.
@originalucifer faith is conviction in the absence of knowledge and that is down right scary.
til, thanks!
Well said
I view it as confidence.
I desperately hope there is sound, logical evidence for your wife’s love.
There is nothing but sophistry and basic philosophy to back religious faith. Religious faith ultimately only comes from peoples’ need for meaning. A basic desire can pull people in all sorts of silly directions if all they do is try and sate it.
Faith is just trust. To do anything at all involves some element of faith. To have no faith would turn a person into a deranged control freak. The problem is not faith but religious organizations who try to warp “have faith” into “don’t ever use your own intelligence to second guess what we say.”
No, faith is more than trust. Faith is trust that you do not verify. Why? Because every time people say they “have faith”, it is distinctly about something they cannot or will not verify. 99.99% of the time, it’s “will not”.
We really need to get these republicans out of office.
That’s a Taliban thing to say.
Are you trying to equate the Catholic, Baptist, protestant, etc. church dictating governance as being no better than the concept of Sharia law?
That’s how I’m interpreting your statement, and in that specific context, I fully agree…
Sharia isn’t specific to Taliban, but whatever, I think I’m on the same page still :)
They are indeed tryIng to enforce the same principles: no rights for women, no rights for non-straight people, etc… why do you think sharia is worse than what’s happening in the US today?
When they were in charge they weren’t much better than the Taliban
American churches and religious organizations have secured themselves so much public funding and political campaign power this past couple decades he kind of isn’t wrong: the separation detailed as important by many of the founders has been dumped.
Tax the FUCK Out of them if they think they have a say on govt
Nah, I think we should just ‘manifest destiny’ their properties.
Of course a guy who can’t separate fapping from family also can’t separate politics from religion.
Y’know, since the other theocracies around the world are so chill.
“Thomas Jefferson was wrong.”
Let’s do separation of Johnson and State instead, please
The separation of church and state doesn’t require a separation of faith and state. Separation of faith and state wasn’t Jeffersons point…
The house comes to consensus on all sorts of shit, often based on faith, while being composed of members of a variety of churches. Been that way for centuries, and can continue to be that way. The first amendment doesn’t prohibit government from making laws based on faith or faith based values. It prohibits government from making laws respective to a church.
Which is all to say that Johnson bringing a bible to the dais is questionable, and boeberts assertion that the church should direct the state is flat out wrong.
Government can have faith and religion. It’s always had faith and religion. Jefferson didn’t advocate that congress be staffed by atheists, he advocated that it be staffed by people of any faith or religion, because the first amendment says exactly that. That was his point…
The expression “separation of church and state” in American politics is from Jefferson’s response to the Danbury Baptist Association (of Connecticut), in which he reassured them that the First Amendment meant that other larger religious groups would not be permitted to use the power of the federal government to oppress Baptists.
Religious persecution had been a live issue in New England, where the Congregationalist Puritans of the Massachusetts Bay Colony had earlier expelled Baptists, Quakers, and other religious nonconformists from the colony.
You can read the full text of the Danbury Baptists’ letter to Jefferson, and Jefferson’s response, here on Wikipedia.
To summarize greatly, the Baptists say “We believe in religious liberty, but we’ve seen persecution before; and we worry that the federal government will be used to impose someone else’s religious views on us. We want a government that only punishes people for harming others, and can’t be pressured into imposing religious laws.”
And Jefferson says “Yes, that’s why we put this First Amendment thing in; to build a wall of separation between church and state.”
This goes along with someone else’s question above in response to Boebert - “which church?” It’s ironic that the biggest benefactors of separation are religions, and they’re the first to try and dismantle it.
The founders of the Constitution and others back then disagreed on a lot of issues and had a few false starts, as well as expected us to continue to modify laws as society changed. But they certainly agreed on no religion within politics, they lived in a world where that had been shown to be problematic over and over. We can see it now as religion creeps back in to our current politics as well as worldwide in other nations.
Yup. And Pennsylvania was founded at a safe enough distance from Massachusetts that the Puritans wouldn’t come down and try to hang the Quakers.
Even if you agree with his sentiments, calling it a misnomer is itself a misnomer.
Mike Johnson is a filthy traitor
