Science and religion are two entirely separate things. Treating religion like science is bad, but treating science like religion is worse.
You cannot “believe in” science; it is not intended to tell you how to live a moral life or provide meaning to your existence, etc. If you try and make it do that, you are not being scientific, you’re being dogmatic.
These concepts aren’t related to each other, and shouldn’t be compared.
Science is descriptive where religion is prescriptive. Granted there are some origin storys in religion (Eve’s sin or Noah’s rainbow) but we’ve had people dismissing their own fables back in the classical age, instead trying to hypothesize how things are really.
This is how Adonai can be a total git and yet declared as just and righteous and benevolent by fiat, what raises challenges to the properties of justice, righteousness or benevolence. Apologists usually retreat to semantics.
Science has its own approach to morality, which is to frame it as a consequentialist formula. Exempli gratia, looking at the histories of civilization, we can see that whenever the bourgoisie neglects the needs of the proletariat, civil unrest, genocide and war follow. Therefore, we might infer that a) the bourgeoisie might be able to defer civic collapse by establishing and enforcing unconditional civil rights and accommodations for its population, and b) that no society has ever been able to do this in perpetuity. The thousand year reich is still a fiction.
The religious equivalent is scriptural passages to kings ( govern wisely ) and to bonded servants, ( obey ), without any elaboration on the mechanics or consequences.
Consensus among religious scholars is that scripture (whether Christian, Muslim, Hellenic, Nubian or whatever) are just early attempts at moral philosophy distilled down to divine command theory, which is very basic deontological ethics (creed-based ethics). With centuries (and centuries) of further thought on the matter, our religious ministries have focused more on profiteering than on keeping up with the times.
Science is descriptive where religion is prescriptive.
This is true, but also it’s prescriptive about different things… religion is focused on morality, which isn’t the kind of thing science is useful for; morality is a philosophical and religious thing.
This is how Adonai can be a total git and yet declared as just and righteous and benevolent by fiat, what raises challenges to the properties of justice, righteousness or benevolence. Apologists usually retreat to semantics.
Or “the lord moves in mysterious ways,” type hand waving.
Science has its own approach to morality, which is to frame it as a consequentialist formula
I wouldn’t call that science, that’s philosophy
Science has its own approach to morality, which is to frame it as a consequentialist formula. Exempli gratia, looking at the histories of civilization, we can see that whenever the bourgoisie neglects the needs of the proletariat, civil unrest, genocide and war follow. Therefore, we might infer that a) the bourgeoisie might be able to defer civic collapse by establishing and enforcing unconditional civil rights and accommodations for its population, and b) that no society has ever been able to do this in perpetuity. The thousand year reich is still a fiction.
This is … a political science theory relying on haphazard historiography, maybe?
I do not know anyone claiming to have a “science of morality” that u would consider to be scientific, or moral…
Science and religion are two entirely separate things. Treating religion like science is bad, but treating science like religion is worse.
You cannot “believe in” science; it is not intended to tell you how to live a moral life or provide meaning to your existence, etc. If you try and make it do that, you are not being scientific, you’re being dogmatic.
These concepts aren’t related to each other, and shouldn’t be compared.
Science is descriptive where religion is prescriptive. Granted there are some origin storys in religion (Eve’s sin or Noah’s rainbow) but we’ve had people dismissing their own fables back in the classical age, instead trying to hypothesize how things are really.
This is how Adonai can be a total git and yet declared as just and righteous and benevolent by fiat, what raises challenges to the properties of justice, righteousness or benevolence. Apologists usually retreat to semantics.
Science has its own approach to morality, which is to frame it as a consequentialist formula. Exempli gratia, looking at the histories of civilization, we can see that whenever the bourgoisie neglects the needs of the proletariat, civil unrest, genocide and war follow. Therefore, we might infer that a) the bourgeoisie might be able to defer civic collapse by establishing and enforcing unconditional civil rights and accommodations for its population, and b) that no society has ever been able to do this in perpetuity. The thousand year reich is still a fiction.
The religious equivalent is scriptural passages to kings ( govern wisely ) and to bonded servants, ( obey ), without any elaboration on the mechanics or consequences.
Consensus among religious scholars is that scripture (whether Christian, Muslim, Hellenic, Nubian or whatever) are just early attempts at moral philosophy distilled down to divine command theory, which is very basic deontological ethics (creed-based ethics). With centuries (and centuries) of further thought on the matter, our religious ministries have focused more on profiteering than on keeping up with the times.
This is true, but also it’s prescriptive about different things… religion is focused on morality, which isn’t the kind of thing science is useful for; morality is a philosophical and religious thing.
Or “the lord moves in mysterious ways,” type hand waving.
I wouldn’t call that science, that’s philosophy
This is … a political science theory relying on haphazard historiography, maybe?
I do not know anyone claiming to have a “science of morality” that u would consider to be scientific, or moral…
Huh. You seem to be using words in ways that are not consistent with how I understand them.
I do not understand what you mean by philosophy or morality according to your responses. You might be writing in a different language than I am.